Well, I know I said that this blog was over for a while, but I just had to post some of my thoughts on the updated text from the NIV, which appeared on the Biblica website here today. I know that it’s early to say, but I am bowled over by my first impressions and can’t wait for the print edition to hit the shelves in March. Anyway, as for the meat and potatoes, some changes of note:
GOSPELS
- Matthew 1:18 reads “pregnant through the Holy Spirit” instead of “with child” thus retaining the TNIV’s change.
- Mark 1:1 retains the phrase “the Son of God” which was demoted to a footnote in the TNIV.
- Mark 1:23 reads “impure spirit” instead of “evil spirit”. I suspect this change will be consistent across the board in the gospels. This is a positive move, although I’m unsure as to why “unclean spirit” was overlooked.
- John 1:18 retains the TNIV’s “in closest relationship with the Father” instead of “at the Father’s side”.
- John 11:6 has changed from “yet” to “So”. Read the passage to see why that completely changes the meaning.
- John 15 has the archaic term normally translated “abide” in the ESV consistently rendered as “remain”.
EPISTLES
- Romans 1:3 has changed from “regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David, and who through the Spirit of holiness was declared with power to be the Son of God” to the TNIV’s “regarding his Son, who as to his earthly life was a descendant of David, and who through the Spirit of holiness was appointed Son of God in power”.
- Romans 1:5 “obedience that comes from faith” is retained in favour of the TNIV’s “faith and obedience”. Phew.
- Romans 1:7 “saints” is now “holy people”.
- Romans 1:17 has retained the TNIV’s “righteousness of God” instead of “righteousness from God”. This change is consistent throughout the NT.
- Romans 3:20 “observing the law” now reads “works of the law”. Hurrah! This change is consistent throughout the NT.
- Romans 8 is a shocker (in a good way). Sarx has now been consistently rendered as flesh! Hurrah again. This change is consistent throughout the NT except when flesh doesn’t make sense.
- Romans 9:22 rather annoyingly to this Calvinist, inserts “although”.
- Romans 12:1 “spritual act of worship” now reads “true and proper worship”.
- 1 Corinthians 7:1 “It is good for a man not to marry” now reads “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.”
GENDER
The NIV has largely stuck with the gender inclusive/accurate language of the TNIV, although it seems to have adopted a slightly more sane approach.
- Genesis 1:26 reads “Let us make mankind” instead of “Let us make man”.
- Psalm 1:1 reads “Blessed is the one” instead of “Blessed is the man” and thus avoids the pluralized text of the TNIV here.
- Mark 1:27,28 reads “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.” The temptation to translate “man” as “human beings” thus obscuring the link between “man” and “the Son of Man” is avoided.
- Adelphos is consistently rendered brothers and sisters throughout the bible.
- Gender specific pronouns like “he”, “him”, “his”, etc have thankfully been dropped in favour of plural pronouns. This is the way people speak after all. I want a koine translation, not an elitist/archaic one.
QUIBBLES
Minor quibbles I have (and these are down to personal taste):
- I’d have liked to have seen a change from “sacrifice of atonement” (e.g. Romans 3:25) to the superior “propitiation.”
- I’d have liked a “For” at the beginning of Romans 1:18. There must be a good reason for this being the only translation in the English-speaking world to omit it, but I’m unaware of it!
- I’d like to have seen the term rendered “remain” in John 15 consistently translated in John’s letters.
- Romans 9:22 (see above).
- I’d have liked “I have revealed you” in John 17:6 to be rendered “I have revealed your name” cf. v26. Rendering it this way unnecessarily obscures the link to the revelation of the Lord’s name in Exodus 34.
Quibbles aside, I am over the moon at the update. The translation reflects the broad range of influences on the board of translators. It has managed to become more literal while becoming more linguistically relevant at the same time; a truly astonishing feat. Has the huge popularity of the ESV encouraged the translators to move the NIV down this path? Has Doug Moo’s oversight and the more conservative translators (e.g. Mounce) ensured that the gender changes are more felicitous than those of the, at times eccentric, TNIV? Who knows.
What is certain is that the ESV now has a major competitor and I am seriously considering switching this coming March.
Good to see you online.
[...] N.J. Mackison makes observations from the gospels, epistles, on gender, and shares his own quibbles. [...]
Thanks for this. I appreciate the fact that you’re being objective even in places that really bug you!
Ha ha! I’m not normally complimented with the virtue of objectivity! Thanks for stopping by David.
[...] hours? But N. J. Mackison (I hope I got the name right) does the best job I saw last night with a variety of observations, including the change from “saints” to “holy people.” This one is [...]
This is helpful! Thanks.
I thought you and your readers might find it useful to know that I’ve just put up some pages that show how similar the NIV2011 is to the NIV1984 and the TNIV. My pages also show each verse where the NIV2011 differs from the NIV1984 or the TNIV in an easily read / clear manner.
The pages are online @ http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/
I’d appreciate any comments or suggestions if anyone has any. Please either email me robert@slowley.com or leave a comment on my blog post http://community.livejournal.com/robhu_bible/4977.html
Thank you,
-RobHu
I’ve significantly updated my NIV2011 comparison pages. I’ve improved the wording, fixed the colouring in of changes (and made it clearer), made some of the tables clearer, fixed some mistakes that made some of my numbers slightly off, and have added more explanatory text.
Perhaps the biggest additions though are these two new pages:
Top 250 added / removed words:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/most_added_removed_words.html
Top 250 most changed verses:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/most_changed_verses.html
You can also look at the details of the changes within a book (this was always there, but some people didn’t realise), e.g.
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/Genesis.html
The start page itself can be found @
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/
It’s also worth knowing that John Dyer has made a series of similar (excellent) pages:
http://donteatthefruit.com/2010/11/niv-2011-every-last-change/
-RobHu
I’ve just updated it again. The measure used for how different a verse is has been improved, and you can now see every instance of when a word has been added / removed.
For instance here is the list of every time the word ‘humankind’ has been added or removed when going from the TNIV to the NIV2011:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/words/tniv_humankind.html
The full list of changed words can be found here:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/most_added_removed_words.html
-RobHu
My computer generated comparison of the NIV2011 with the TNIV and NIV1984 has had many major updates:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/
1. Greek text – now includes the SBLGNT with apparatus
2. Hebrew text – HBS text included (experimental)
3. Most changed verses list compared with both TNIV and NIV1984:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/most_changed_verses_tniv.html
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/most_changed_verses_niv1984.html
4. List of (possible) proper noun changes:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/proper_noun_changes.html
5. List of word changes relevant to the gender language debate:
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/cbmw_words.html
6. List of all words in text (warning: page is very large)
http://www.slowley.com/niv2011_comparison/all_words.html
Plus many many bug fixes, improvements in presentation, and other minor fixes.
-RobHu
I find it strange that you say you want a koine translation rather than an elitist, archaic one, and then you favor a very akoine term like propitiation immediately afterward.
But in all honesty, a good review. Thanks for posting it.
Thanks for this Gary. It may seem like a contradiction, but I believe there is no better rendering than propitiation. “Sacrifice of atonement” is just as vague to most readers, so on that score, I’d rather have a more accurate “vague” term.
Welcome back my Nicky! I too am following this new NIV with interest. Greatest disappointment 1 Timothy 2v12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet.
I think A. Kostenberger’s book has argued persuasively that the word ‘authentein’ should be translated in a positive way. It is not just that women are forbidden to assume authority so that if they are given authority to teach to the mixed congregation that is OK. But the sense is better captured with the esv – ‘I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.’
I do so many positives of the updated NIV but this does some to have an egalitarian bias – that is unhelpful.
http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/justintaylor/2008/07/30/interview-with-andreas-j-kstenberger-on/
Wow Paul, I missed that one. Thanks for the heads up.
Do you use the ESV with your kids?
We do have an ESV children’s bible that we have used for breakfast devotions. But I think the children read the Good News Version or the New Century Version for their own bible readings.
Would the NIV’s fudge on 1 Tim. 2:12 be enough to stop you using it as a pulpit bible?